KARL JASPERS FORUM
TA111 (Beamish)

Response 10  (to C8, Müller)

 

( CONCERNING TIME AND REALITY )
by Peter Beamish
18 December 2008, posted 27 December 2008

 

[Herbert Müller]
Question: why would EXPERIENCE (not 'one') stop flowing 'When one flies, drives, or walks'? The flowing occurs within one's experience.

[Peter Beamish]
Answer: Au Contraire! Information, in both "conventional time, t" and in "Rhythm Based Time, T" is "TRANSPORTED," via "Mass &/or Energy Vectors," as individual "CARGOS" of/in such "Vectors." And "cargos" do NOT "flow!"

[HM]
 You did not really respond to my point, which was "<2> 'Space' and 'time' are identified in a clear way only after structuring, which in this case includes quantification with the aid of structures called 'dimensions'); the quantification is a defining aspect, there are no [spaces and no times] without it. If you doubt that, you have to explain why there are so many discussions about whether 'reality has' three or four (or more) dimensions. <3> But for that to happen someone has to count them (with the help of structures called 'numbers'): in terms of (structures called) 'feet', 'pulse beats', or whatever else is practical. This need for counting is easily forgotten; but in case you forget it and say that space and time exist and are structured in a mind-independent (MIR) way, you claim (implicitly and inadvertently) that extension and flow measure (quantify) themselves in order to become space and time. And besides, since the measuring procedure ('operation', Bridgman 1927) for extension requires a different method - from that for flow, the two have become different structures in public opinion."    It is an error, I want to suggest, to treat dimensions as if they were a property of an imaginary mind-independent agency called 'reality', or 'space', etc., without anybody being involved. What one can really say is that one can handle the extension aspect with three orthogonal dimensions. Reality, space, and time are concepts (mental tools), and should not be seen as though they in themselves can have something; instead one can structure (constitute) reality of the physical kind with the help of tools like dimensions, numbers, etc.

[PB]
Reality does indeed have Three "Orthogonal Spacial Dimensions," or "OSDs," which are "mind-INDEPENDENT vectors," UNLIKE "REAL NOW TIME."  All known temporal concepts are scalar (NOT vector) labels _TRANSPORTED_ "through space vectors" by "Mass &/or Energy Vectors" which under strict conditions become: "Mental Vector Processes, MVPs," seemingly a most important concept in the 21st century "BIOphysics" of both reality & mind !  Above vectors, including both "information in t" and "informaTion in T," can indeed travel through "space vectors" but they do not become "MVPs," unless they are received by a mind and thus become "mind-DEPENDENT." The other major condition of "MVPs" is that they are "formed" at mind edges.  Temporal concepts are "structured" by "zillions" of clocks in our world.  Temporal concepts are "quantified" by "Many Minds Scientific Consensus."  It seems that "duration" (the difference between temporal scalar labels, secs/mins/hrs) is your "mental tool," but "3 OSDs" are mind-INDEPENDENT.

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Peter Beamish
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